On The Bit

[bapuppydog]

I have a slight problem...I am currently working with a horse for my mom and I cant seem to get him to stay on the bit. He is a gray 17hh warmblood imported and for some reason he wont stay on the bit for me. He will flex and go on for about thirty seconds before turning his nose out and up again. How do I fix this? I need him to stay on the bit willingly, not because I am making him. Help!

[eaty]

Okay, i understand what you mean, but what i am going to say a lot of people don't like for i don't know what reason.

My best friend who has horses, read this book about bits, and the book was saying that basically bits are bad for horses, because when they ran around free before people were around them, did they run around with pieces of metal in there mouths? no they did not, and also horses perform better without a bit, i know someone with proof she took video of the horse with a bit then without a bit, and the change is huge. So i would try just riding the horses without a bit, then the horses will listen to you better and trust you more, because the bit hurts them so they are more likely to not listen to you and not respond to you when you tell them to do something, also a horse will relax when they have no bit.

So i hope that no one took any offense from what i just said, i don't mean to tell people that they are going a bad thing to there horse or that they are doing something wrong, i am just saying thatit is something to try.

[Cem]

I'm assuming you've checked the fit of his bit and made sure it's not hurting him but maybe working on the bit, in an outline is hurting him somehow? Other than that all I can really suggest is that you stick with it making sure you reward him by loosening your grip on the reins slighty when he goes how you want him. I'm not saying drop the contact, it only has to be a tiny relaxation so he knows that moving like that won't hurt him. I know how frustrating it can be to get them how you want for just a few seconds, you just have to be careful not to get frustrated with him and tightening your self up and therefore blocking his movement. Stick with it. If theres no physical reason for it then you'll get there eventually, you may just have to be patient.

Eaty I can see where you're coming from and in some cases I completely agree with you, but if the bit is fitted correctly there is no reason that the horse can't work just as well with one. Most horses aren't trained to work without a bit and some, particulaly strong horses, would take advantage of the lack of bit to mess around more than if they had one.

Just my two cents

[eaty]

Well one thing about horses is that they breath though there nose not there mouth, and they work better when there mouth is closed, but with the bit there mouth is open and they work not as well as they could without it there.

And from what i have seen, i saw this horse who just about bucked the person riding him off, and he is also a strong horse, and they tried him bit less and he was fine. And i have seen many horse bit less and they are fine, and it is easy to not use a bit on a horse, my friend taped two horses who have never been ridden bit less and they did well. And sometime why they mess around is to try and take the bit off because they don't like it, so if you tried with out a bit they would have more reason to relax, then be tense and trying to get the bit away.

But that is just what i have to say about it.

[Cem]

Ok let's not get in to a debate about wether its better to have a bit or go bitless. Like I said I agree with you but can depend on the horse and your are right that a lot will go better without but there are some who will go better with.

[bapuppydog]

Thanks to everyone who posted - I had no idea it would be such a debate! We ride some horses bitless, and I agree completely that horses can often do better without a bit. However, this isnt the case with Alex. We have ridden him without a bit before (often just in a halter) and he behaves perfectly. Until he decides that he is going to be a dork. He stretches out (a very good sign) and then snaps his nose in (for just a second) and takes the lead rope in his mouth and prances around the arena whilst the rider has no contact whatsoever. And while I am a huge believer in natural horsemanship and riding freestyle, etc., I have been distinctly asked by some possible future owners to do dressage with him. And therefore I need to get him on the bit.

Bits dont actually hurt horses like most think they do, as long as it is fitted correctly and not abused. We have a simply elevator snaffle in his mouth (to help him collect himself while still staying soft), mostly because he is young and he needs to learn that his head is connected to his body and that he cannot fit into a small space, no matter how hard he tries, even if his head fits perfectly. As in through a fence. Yes, we are dealing with a regular Einstein here. Oh, he is just too smart.

So anyway, thanks for all the great advice. I asked my mom about changing his bit and she said she would have the dentist look at him sometime this week to see if there is pain involved. I think he might just not want to give up sticking his nose out.

[bapuppydog]

Okay so quick update for all those who were wondering (dont lie, i know you wanted to know_ hehe)...so I talked to my mom and she said that one of the boarders uses a bitless and we might be able to borrow it, just to see how he responds! I was also snooping around my moms library last night (shh dont tell) and I found a book ALL about going bitless and different types of bits! I promise to update you all (since Im sure you are dying to know how this is going because like me, you all have nothing better to do!) (hehe just kidding)...anyway! thanks for everyone who helped me out

[eaty]

Thanks for the update, and i would Love to hear about how the bitless stuff goes, also what is the name of the book? and who is it by?

[horsediva518]

In the western world, its called a hackmore, and people ride with one because they have beter control over the horses head, mainly for speed events and breaking the horse.

[bapuppydog]

Yeah we ride with hackamores sometimes, not just in speed events but a lot of times for hacking or swimming (my two personal favorites)...but the Bitless Bridle is much more than just wihtout a bit, its a system that puts pressure on points in the jaw versus the traditional nose (as in a hackamore)...thanks for the advice, thats a good point!

[bapuppydog]

Yay so I wanted the thank everyone who helped post! We actually decided against bitless, mostly becasue when we tried, he bucked twice and tossed his head in pain (we think it was pinching him). We had the vet come and look, and she said that some horses are really sensitive underneath their jaw and it was possibly hurting him. Soo the bitless is out which sort of turned my mom away from using a hackamore with him for everyday use. My brother suggested using sidereins and a halter, and when we lunged him two days ago and he had the perfect headset! So yesterday I got on him with the sidereins and he went on the bit in about 30 seconds! What a HUGE improvment! thanks to everyone!

[Cem]

Yay! Glad you're getting somewhere with him! Thanks for letting us know

[bapuppydog]

yay so update (i know its been a while)...my friend Anna wanted to ride him the other day and i was thinking hmm this would be a good time to try to get him on the bit so i taught her how to do it and she was riding him and he FINALLY went on the bit and she said he was really soft in his back and he looked soo much like a hunter it was so cute.... so anyway last friday i got on and was riding him and he went on the bit and i hardly asked and he stayed on for a full 3 and a half minutes (my mom was timing him so she could log it in his book), but of course it was so beautiful and then he tripped and lost it and he lost his confidence, but i think he might have lost a couple of brain cells also hehe so thanks to EVERYONE who posted and helped out, you guys are the best!